Wednesday, November 19, 2008

Crisp/Ramon trade breakdown

Louie: What with this royals trade

Joshua: Guess we've given up on Teahan.

Joshua: Well, I think I'm okay with the coco crisp acquisition. We really needed some speed at the top of the lineup and a true leadoff hitter. What did you think?

Louie: I think you are right about speed, but the best part about Royals last year was the pitching in the 7,8.and 9th

Joshua: Yeah. I'm always afraid of giving up good pitching. I don't really buy the argument that relief pitchers are fungible.

Louie: Ramon was a clutch relief pitcher. I am not sure i like the 2 years crisp might give us- 3-4 if we are lucky in exchange for a solid 8th. Also crisp's 2007 numbers were painfully bad, and while he looked good in the playoffs he had lost his job midway through the season

Joshua: I'd be a lot more comfortable with this trade if we still had Leo Nunez.

Louie: that is what i am saying

Joshua: I still don't understand the Jacobs deal.

Louie: we have dealt two good relievers. That deal makes sense if we Gload (Chode) is done and we think the Hawaiian dude needs another year in the minors. Also butler is permanent DH, his fielding blows

Joshua: Shealy deserves a shot no? After last September?

Louie: he will get it but will get hurt real fast, Shealy and Jacobs will battle it out. I can see us keeping them both, dumping gload (chode), and playing butler at DH

Joshua: Only if we unload Ross Chode.

Louie: we must, he is terrible hitter for a corner spot

Joshua: Agreed.

Louie: and we must now deal teahen, which i am fine with. I love his energy and clubhouse presence, but 12-15 hrs for a corner outfielder is not going to cut it

Joshua: Yeah, me too. Hopefully we can get some pitching for Teahan.

Louie: pitching or a SS/2b

Joshua: Yeah. Looks like the Cubs might have a SS/2B that they'd be willing to deal.

Louie: could be. This convo should be posted to the Trifecta blog- it is awesome

Joshua: done

3 comments:

Kurt Outrageous said...

Neyer's opinion of the trade:

But a baseball team is not built in a vacuum. Jacobs and Crisp might push the Royals from 75 wins to 77 or 78 wins. And I'm not at all sure why you make deals that have absolutely no chance of someday getting you to 85-90 wins. If you're a 75-win team and you're going to trade two pretty good young (and cheap) relief pitchers, you should be looking for young players who might someday become stars. Not uninspiring veterans with virtually no up-side.

(http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=3715654&name=Neyer_Rob)

I agree with the underlying premise that we should trade for young stars, but it seems unlikely that other teams would be willing to give us their young position players for middle relievers.

Of course, maybe the Coco trade allows us to trade Teahen to the Cubs for Pie and Cedeno. Then again, Pie would essentially give us three CF (Pie, DeJesus, and Crisp)...

TRIFECTA said...

JoPo weighs in:

Here’s the thing I really like about Crisp: He offers many other talents. He is a terrific defensive center fielder. He is very fast, and he stole 20 or more bases each of his seasons in Boston. He has shown some power, and he is, as mentioned, a good bunter. He is one of the best and most aggressive base runners in the game.

In other words, Crisp gives the Royals a whole new look, even beyond his great name. He allows them to move David DeJesus to left, and those two should cover a lot of ground in the big Kauffman Stadium outfield. His ability to hit the ball into gaps, to beat out infield hits, to pound a few balls over the wall makes him a different kind of offensive player than anyone else on the Royals. Also, he’s got something to prove — he looked like a blossoming star in 2005 when he hit .300 with 42 doubles, 16 homers and 15 stolen bases in Cleveland. He was not able to regain that in Boston for various reasons, but he is convinced that he can in Kansas City.

“I want to show everybody how I can play when I’m healthy,” he says.

And: “I can go out and play every day, which is all I’ve ever wanted to do my whole life.”

And: “I know what I can and cannot do, and I think that makes me a pretty good ballplayer.”

It’s always good when a ballplayer comes in with something to prove.

Now, the trade opens up some interesting possibilities — it’s clear Moore is not finished dealing this offseason. He now might trade Mark Teahen, who doesn’t seem to have a place to play. There are continuing rumors that Moore is willing to trade 23-year-old Billy Butler. We really can’t judge this Crisp trade completely until we see how it all shakes out.

For now, though, it looks good. It’s good to get an everyday player for a middle reliever — even a guy with a dynamite change-up like Ramirez — and Crisp should make things a lot more fun. I would offer a word of advice to relievers Ron Mahay, John Bale and Robinson Tejada: I would rent in Kansas City for the time being.

KayCee Moe said...

This is unprecedented!! The entire time I have been a Royals' fan, the Royals' have NEVER exchanged young talent for washed-up players. I dare anyone to come up with any example, besides Cooking Chili Davis, Chuck Knobs, Dean Palmer, Reggie Sanders, Kevin Appier (the second-stint), Babe Ruth (seeing if anyone is paying attention)....and it's not like any of our young talent we traded has gone on to do anything great besides, Carlos Beltran, Johnny Damon, Jermaine Dye......well ok at least we don't trade our REALLY promising talent such as former rookie-of-the-year winners Angel Berroa and Bob "the Hammer"......